0117 6BCRET THE WHITE HOUSE WASH INGTON MEMORANDUM OF CONVERSATION DECLASSIFIED PER E 0 13526 Z -t Xo ‘ K6M SUBJECT MeetingwithPrime Minister Vladimir Putin of Russia PARTICIPANTS The President Secretary of StateMadeleineAlbright Samuel Berger Assistant to the President forNational Security Affairs Gene Sperling Assistant to the President forEconomic Policy and Director of the National Economic Council Stephen Sestanovich Ambassador­at­Large and SpecialAdviserto the Secretary of Stateforthe New IndependentStates Ted Truman Assistant TreasurySecretary RobertWescott SpecialAssistant to the President forInternational Finance Andrew Weiss Director forRussia Ukraine EurasiaAffairs notetaker Nick Sorokin interpreter Prime Minister Vladimir Putin ForeignMinister IgorIvanov GennadiyShabannikov Ambassador of the RussianFederation to New Zealand Sergey Prikhodko Deputy Head Presidential Administration Mikhail Fradkov Minister of ForeignTrade Aleksandr Livshits SpecialPresidential Representative to International Financial Institutions IgorSechin Secretariat Head Office of Prime Minister Interpreter DATE TIME AND PLACE September 12 1999 1 31 ­ 2 42 p m local time StamfordPlaza Hotel Auckland SFCRffP Classified by RobertA Bradtke Reason 1 5 d Declassify On 12 11 2010 ■DEe-R S- The President I had a good conversation withPresident Yeltsin in preparation forour meetingtoday First of all I wanted to expresscondolenceson behalfof the Americanpeopleforthe terrible apartmentbombing incident and the lives lost We have had similar incidents and I know thattheycan frighten people tremendously U I would like to discussthe important issuesin front of us that will shape our partnership in the yearsto come Then I'mhappy to listen to any issuesyou'dlike to raise First on arms control Strobehas been inMoscow for discussions withMamedov These are important discussions and I know thattheyare difficult I want to make clearthatI wish to preservethe ABM Treaty which is important to both our countries However thereare forcesin our Republican Party who would like to torpedothe ABM Treaty But it's alsoclearthatthereare new threats to both the UnitedStatesand Russia from countries such as NorthKorea There isalsonew technology thatisbeingdevelopedthatmight become a viable means to providetypesof defensesthat previously have not been available 1 I onlywant to repeatwhat I told Boris I want to work on this because of the perceived new threat from certain countries If thereare any benefits from this new technology I think they shouldbe sharedby the UnitedStateswithothercountries as much as possible I alsosupportthe desireof your country to tryto cut levels of weapons below START IIlevels At present 1 am not able to agree to go as low as you would like but I told BoristhatI want to come as closeas possible We need to keep talking about this issue Second on nonproliferation You have worked hard to build the legalfoundations thatcan be used to stop the flowof sensitive technologies I have thatthese foundations can now be used effectively That isessential to head offnew sanctions legislation As you know our system finds hundredsof violations everyyear There isstrongsupportin Congress fornew sanctions legislation againstIran Iraq and similar countries There's a good chance thatthislegislation will pass within coming months I've been fighting the peoplewho want to impose new •fiE eR 'BT­ ­SECRET sanctions legislation Borisknows that But theyhave a new head of steam Your government's cooperation on this issuewith the Vice President and Sandy Bergerisvery important to what happens next On Dagestan I know thatyou have faceddifficult situations in Chechnya and now Dagestan I have spoken out about this problem So long as you use appropriate means to fight terrorism and separatists the UnitedStateswill standwith you 2I On corruption these inquiries on money laundering are important and thereisonlyone way to handlethem I am encouragedthata team of your law enforcement officials is coming to Washingtonnext week These cases must be handledon their merits They must not be politicized What Boristold me on the phone was alsoimportant He said thatthe reasonhe vetoedthe money laundering bill was because of Constitutional problemswiththe bill and thathe would sign a new and improvedbill I think it's important thatthis happen as quickly as possible ps'T On economic reform I want Russia to be strongand successful Your economy isbenefiting because oil prices are goingup The IMF has saidthatit will work withyou ina transparent way That cooperation is important and can helpput the worstof your economic problemsbehindyou The most important thingyou can do isarticulate a clearstrategic planon economic reformand stick to it That will have a good impacton your discussions withthe IMF I guaranteethattheywill be willing to help if you show thatyou are willing to helpyourselves CS'f I know thatyou probably alsowant to talk about Kosovo I have talked enough There are probably otherissues too But you know thatI have tried hard to be a friend of Russia's and Boris's I hope thatyou will contribute to taking Russia in the right direction JSl Prime Minister Putin First of all I'd like to thankyou for meetingwithme The President and I discussedingreatdetail you last phone call withhim He alsodescribed the things that you have accomplished together and I must say thatI appreciate your unwaveringsupportforcooperation withRussia I believe thatthis approachmight be tracedback to your yearsworking withSenatorFullbright IfI recall correctly he had a similar attitude about the U S approachtowardthe Soviet CT PPT T ­8BCRBT 4 Union I think thatyou have shown a veryopen­mindedand constructive attitude towardmy country That's why I think it's important to implementall the agreementsreachedat the last meetingbetween you two Presidents Allour efforts are beingdirected at implementing theseagreements The AmericanSecretary of Defense isarriving in Moscow today I alsoam looking forwardto the visit of your Secretary of Energy The Russiansideispreparedto engage in serious dialogue I feelsorryforyour Vice President The Prime Ministers on our sidekeep changing This has to do withour domesticpolitics but we understand thatit's not conduciveto building strong ties You are right thatthe issuesbeforeus must command constant attention Regardingthe reports thathave appearedin the press about Russianinvolvement inmoney laundering I am well­informed about your position thanksto the contacts between Foreign Minister Ivanovand your Secretary of State ForeignMinister Ivanovplansto be inNew York forthe UnitedNationsGeneral Assembly and I do hope you'll find time to meet withhim I must say thatthis scandalismostlymotivated by our domestic politics I hope I will have chance fora more informal conversation withMr Berger I will talk to him about how we want to build our relations and how we must turnthis situation to our advantage I am absolutely opposed to attempts to play us offagainst each other Othersare trying to do this for their own reasons Iftheysucceed theywill gain not us People are trying to use thisissueto disrupt our relations withthe UnitedStates That iswhy I supportsendingour team of expertsto the U S I need to say thatmoney laundering has always existed inmany countries Russia is simplythe victim of such a scheme To reiterate I am preparedto discussthe factsin greater detail if you are interested On the issuesyou raise­­onABM my personal view may be closerto what you saidthan to the positions articulated by otherpeopleon the Russianside I discussedthis issuehere yesterday and inMoscow too I think thatthe threat of nuclear proliferation isreal­­just lookat Indiaand Pakistan There are alsoothercountries to be worried about the so­called threshold states as wellas the rogue states We •OE€RBT ■ ­SECRE T’ alsomust take intoaccountthe possibility of nuclear terrorism The recentterrorist acts inMoscow have to do withthe situation in Dagestan I have everyreasonto believe thatthe perpetrators are the same as the ones who delivered the strikes against the UnitedStates Usama Bin­Ladenhas declared his intention to move to Chechnya His groups already have a presenceinBaku and Chechnya He hasn't moved because he is afraid we will apprehendhim or take otheractions We have serious resourcesin this respectand will use our technology to our advantage I understand the concernsof the UnitedStateson ABM Of course the processshouldbe set up in a way so thatno sideis caused undue concernabout its own security I have inmind not justRussia but alsoFrance China and othernuclear powers So this isa topicforfurther negotiations I am aware of the UnitedStates' plans I believe it isappropriate to maintain constant contact On START IIand START III we were verycloseto ratifying STTUIT II I think thatfuture developments will be positive in this area We have good relations withthe left factions in the Duma We are keepingup­ a steadydialogue withthe peoplein the Duma who are expertsin this area They believe it is absolutely impossible forthem to ratify the Treatyif we don't demonstrate thatour otherdiscussions on arms control are entirely compatible but I have noticed some waveringinthe opposite direction lately I believe we shouldcontinue to developour overall efforts in the context of further discussions on START III and tryto have a positive impacton the START IIratification process Doing it thatway makes me think thatSTART IIwill become a more realistic prospect CSl I don't believe thatit isnecessaryto reduce to the 1 000­ 1 500 level forstrategic systems It's important to preserve the negotiating processand show the worldthatwe can achieve realresults CST You suggesteda number of topics fordiscussion but I have one more I would like to thankthe UnitedStatesforthe food supplies you have provided I would like to report to you that all agreementsbetween us are beinghonored The proceeds raised by salesof the food are beingdirected to the Pension ­SECRg r ­SBeRET 6 Fund The onlyoutstanding issueisDagestan We have 15 000­ 18 000 refugeesthereand would like to send some of the food aid to Dagestan freeof charge Developmentsin Dagestan are completely different from what happened earlier inChechnya Duringthe Chechen war many Chechens fledto Dagestanwhere theywere sheltered by Dagestanis The new fighting was caused by mercenaries from Chechnya and Arab countries who invadedDagestan The peopleof Dagestan joinedforceswithFederaltroopsindefenseof their homeland In cases where supportfrom the Federalforceswas latearriving the Dagestanis maintained their defensesuntil helparrived They asked forour help They want us to help arm them so thattheycan fight against the Chechens pSjT Most importantly interms of the mentality of peoplefrom the Caucasus the Dagestanis believe themselvesto be superior to the Chechens so theyregardthis incursion as veryoffensive especially because their land isbeinginvadedby a fraternal nation That's why the peaceful population is leaving their homes and moving to the capital of Dagestan I visited and saw how theylive The situation ismore stabilized I think it would be appropriate to send some food to Dagestan freeof charge On our cooperation on Iran I must admit thatwe express opposition to your characterization of the situation I must draw your attention to the factthatIranisour neighbor and it would not be inour interest to strengthen Iran's capabilities in theseareas Yes it's truethatIranis building new missiles but theyare doingso withwestern European technology This concernsus no lessthan it does you The Europeans alsoare becoming more active in competingfor arms salesto Iran Our companies are feeling the pressure They say we want to sell things to Iran participate inthat market I think thatwe must cooperate more closely inhavinga clearer idea of what kindof cooperation isjustified Where are the right boundaries and limits I would verymuch like to emphasize thatwe understand thisissue We'llcontinue to work on the issueof exportcontrols especially in the missile area But we are very concernedabout the training Iranians are receiving inothercountries as well This a subject that demands our constant attention ­fifieRST­ The President What about Kosovo How do you think we're doing Prime Minister Putin Thingscouldbe better I assume you have information thatthe Albanians don'twant to disarm I understand thatit's a productof yourAdministration's efforts I understand thatyou believe thattherewere problemsof a humanitarian nature But you need to put the probleminperspective We were talking about 50 thousandor maybe 100­150 thousandAlbanian refugees But the number of Serb refugeesisthreetimesgreater The most difficult problemisnot this The most difficult problem is thatwinter is coming The destruction of infrastructure especially in the energyarea means thatYugoslavia is in fora verydifficult period I am aware of your past statements about Milosevic I think thatthe fateof millions ismore important than the fateof one person However our positions on this personclosely coincide From our assessmentof the situation he didnot behave appropriately What is important isto have good cooperation between our two countries StrobeTalbott did a lotinthe diplomatic arena We dida lotto dampen the ambitions of the military on both sides I believe we continue to need each otherthere Things couldevolveintoviolence in Kosovo I believe thatwe have set a verygood precedenton military­to­military cooperation T ' One bad thingthatwe'refacedwithisthe dismantling of Yugoslavia It's difficult to imagineconditions when the Serbs are goingto return to Kosovo We have similar problemsin Russia Lifeshows thatthe use of forcedoes not prompt the final resolution' of a conflict Dagestan isa smallrepublic There are 100 different ethnic groups living there They speak different languages The international languageisRussian of course They have their own problems of course It's rather difficult forus to manage the probleminside Russia But most groups inDagestan support the Russianstance If you intervene in a conflict withuse of force thereare goingto be consequences But otherwise we'd be deadlockedthere ­ efieRer SECRET The President For thingsto work out in Kosovo we need to be together just as we are in Bosnia Ifthe UN's representative has a planforthe Albaniansto at leastpartially disarm we will work withthem We alsowant the Serbs to return to their homes ­­that's their right On the economy it's important foryou to fight crimeand corruption and enforcethe ruleof law EXIM islooking at applications forsome projects and the chairmanof EXIM is goingto Moscow soon It's important to get these kindsof things going Anotherexample isthe team on money laundering thatiscoming to Washington Duringthese investigations it's important to show thateverything isbeinghandledby the book Also with oil prices high you're in a situation where you can get a lot more done I remember thatin the early1990s you coulduse a few good international projects to givepeopleconfidence that Russiawas headed in the right direction CSj Prime Minister Putin We inRussia are used to thesekinds when you problems By the way I met you in St Petersburg visited Much has been accomplished sincethattime Our economic cooperation isveryimportant and will helpRussia to develop The increase in oil prices has alsohad an impacton the ruble We will need to devalueit a bit perhaps 6­8 percent I have asked the Central Bank to do this and to change the exchange ratewiththe dollar to make our exportsmore competitive We need to avoida situation where the dollar rate isartificially restricted and thenwe'reforcedto do something all of a sudden We are pursuing a considered planto deal with the inflated valueof the ruble It's not goingto be harmful The President You'regoing in to an election season That will be a challenge and an opportunity forus These elections and how they're conductedare extremely important I have told Boristhis He's the first elected leaderof Russia but also will be the first leaderto peacefully transfer power throughan election That's a greatthing It's a greatthingfora country You'venever done it before I know it won'tbe the easiest thing But it's extremely important We alsoneed to keep our lines of communication open as we deal withtough issuesand you get closer to your elections ­OBCRBT Prime Minister Putin Yes that's important A lotof things are beinggeared up to ensure thatwe have good results from the Duma elections A lot will depend on the composition of the new Duma Whoever entersparliament Russiawill need to develop its economy and its relations withthe international community and the UnitedStates Duringthe elections some candidates may say things about the UnitedStatesthataren't verynice But thatdoesn't mean that theyhave a different view of our relations I know almostall of the Communists personally If theykeep their position in the Duma theywill advocatebasically the same policies as the government If theystayin opposition we'll still be able to pursue roughly the same approach Maybe some of them will call formore of a roleforthe statein the economy but interms of substance there's no bigdifference It's mostlysloganeering The President I am counting on Yeltsin and you One thing thatyou have going foryou isthatyou can tryto show that thereisno credible alternative to the path thatyou're on If the opposition doesn't have a credible set of proposals that will helpyou Prime Minister Putin Unfortunately that's not the case Russia does not have an established political system People don'tread programs They lookat the facesof the leaders regardless of what partytheybelongto regardless of whether theyhave a program or not The opposition's whole strategy duringthe election campaign is to stir things up to have an emotional impacton largegroups of people Of course you are more aware than anyone about this tactic Starting withany personina position of responsibility at the local level the reality isthatmost peopleare goingto blame him foreverything Allthe problems will be on hisshoulders Most of our population thinks thatway and isnot very sophisticated That's the reality we need to deal with President Yeltsin understands this and takesit into account Some of hisstatements and actions may surprise you but you need to factor in how they impacton society and the motivations behindthem You need to take thisintoaccount Part of hisactions are determined by this Some of hisactions are simplymistakes But leaving asideany statements thathave SEGRB T­ ■e­EGRg f concernedyou pleasebear inmind thatwe have certain plans and are acting according to them The President I lookforwardto seeinghow theyunfold Prime Minister Putin I appreciate everything you have done to contribute to the developmentof relations between our countries I know thatyou have othermeetingsto attend The■President Thank you verymuch U Itwas good to see you End of Conversation This document is from the holdings of The National Security Archive Suite 701 Gelman Library The George Washington University 2130 H Street NW Washington D C 20037 Phone 202 994-7000 Fax 202 994-7005 nsarchiv@gwu edu Read related article Putin Clinton and Presidential Transitions 2020-11-02